WNBA legend Nancy Lieberman is often credited as one of the pioneers of modern women’s basketball. The “Lady Magic” impact on basketball was groundbreaking, with her on-court dominance first as a player and then as a trailblazing coach. The Old Dominion alum has served as an assistant coach for the NBA’s Sacramento Kings and head coach for the former Detroit Shock.

Lieberman is now serving as the head coach for the Dallas Power in Big3. After leading Power to a championship in 2018, Lieberman is back for the title again.

Before her championship game against Gary Payton’s Boston Ball Hogs on Saturday, Lieberman spoke to EssentiallySports in an exclusive interview. The legendary star opened up about her competition and family bond with Gary Payton, the current state of the WNBA, and Caitlin Clark’s impact on women’s basketball.

Editor’s note: The following one-on-one conversation has been edited and condensed for clarity.

This is the fourth championship game now for you, and Gary Payton is coaching opposite you. How big is this game and what’s different from the 2018 team?

Lieberman: “In 2018, we had some of the greatest of the game. We had Corey Maggette, Big Baby Davis, Coutinho Mobley, Quinton Richardson, and Birdman. They were just epic as former NBA guys who were so disciplined in their approach.

Gary Payton is an unbelievable coach, won the championship a couple of years ago with the Bivouac. So it’s an honor to be a part of this.”

Gary’s built a reputation as one of the biggest trash talkers in the game. Has he ever trash-talked to you?

Lieberman: “No. And we’ve been friends for a long time. We’re thicker than thieves. Matter of fact, ‘The Glove’ lost the glove years ago when he retired. ‘Lady Magic’ lost her passing when she stopped passing the basketball. It’s not about us. It’s about the players.”

How big of a threat is Jeremy Pargo to you? And have you got a special plan for him?

Lieberman: “We do. We game plan for everybody. That’s my job to put together a scouting report and a game plan. How we take away the team’s strength. And if we’re disciplined, which we will be, we feel very confident.”

How much momentum does that Miami win give this team? 

Lieberman: “The Miami win- you never want to say payback, but we were winning a year ago in the semis in Dallas. And we were up six, but we ended up losing to Miami. So winning was payback. We were excited to be able to do that.”

Elijah Stewart is one of the biggest reasons Dallas is here. Do you think he gets overlooked sometimes when people talk about the best players in Big 3?

Lieberman: “Well, he shouldn’t. And if you see his podcast, he certainly is going to tell you that he doesn’t want to be overlooked.”

Gary Payton is a great friend of yours. Does he bring out the best in you? And is the loser going to take the winner out to dinner?

Lieberman: “I would take him out anytime he wants. He’s family to me. We’ve done a lot of media together. We’ve talked about our families and our upbringing. And he’s coming to my charity event in September, and I went to his charity event. I knew that was really important for him. 

Oh, trust me, we’re going after each other as coaches in preparation. But isn’t that the beauty of life? You not only get to compete against people you love and admire. You get to celebrate the person that wins. When it’s all said and done, you might not be happy, but you shake that guy’s hand and say, well done.”

You’ve coached men, women, veterans, and up-and-comers. What is it like coaching in the Big 3?

Lieberman: “The guys who initially came and played in this league, some of them aged out. They’ve evolved and opened the game up to Euros. Now you have the best players in the world. And now you’re seeing the second iteration of NBA guys coming to the league. It’s really great to see these guys who took their last bite of the NBA apple but still love the game. It’s a soft landing to retirement.”

Lieberman won a silver medal at the 1976 Montreal Olympics, the same Olympics that women’s basketball was introduced. She became the youngest American player to win a medal at the Olympics.

You’re credited as the pioneer in this sport. You were the first basketball medalist in the Olympics in 1976. Did you see all of this coming when you were 17?

Lieberman: “When I was 17, I was just hanging on, you know. Sports was so important to me because of my family life. But it just emboldened me to feel good as a woman, to feel whole, not to feel less than. And then when you start winning and all those accomplishments, accountability, responsibility, how do I show up each day for my teammates? What am I giving to the fans and to the teams that I’m playing for? I have 50 years of these moments.

It’s pretty special. And then it’s rolled over into men’s sports. You have people like Ice Cube open the door of opportunity to people like me.”

How do you feel about Caitlin Clark’s MVP case?

Lieberman: “Yes, she’s in the MVP conversation. She is. If you match up her statistics with the Fever, I think the Fever might be in fourth place right now.”

I want to ask you about Caitlin Clark’s impact on the WNBA

Lieberman: “The W right now, we’re in growing pains. For 30 years, we were kind of at a certain level, even though we were growing a little bit incrementally. This new Collective Bargaining Agreement and the $2.2 billion changed everything. Salaries soared. They’re taking private jets right now. And the economic engine for this is Caitlin Clark. And she shouldn’t have to apologize that for some reason, she moves the financial needle more than any other player right now. It doesn’t mean that A’ja Wilson is not the best player in the world. She is.”

What do you make of the way that Clark wears this superstar role well, and all the scrutiny and all the criticism and opinion about her?

Lieberman: “Well, it’s not a movie. There’s no script. When people thought I was the best player in the world, and I had 99.9% of the attention, and I knew that there was envy and jealousy. She’s just got to do her job. 

Everybody has an opinion, and apparently we’re all entitled to it. It’s called social media, and it’s okay. We want to hear what the fans say, but when it gets nasty and when it gets political, when it gets racist, you’ve got to cut that c*** out.”

Magic Johnson or Larry Bird? Who is better?

Lieberman: “They’re Twinkies. They were both great. I mean, it’s hard to say who was better. I’m a point guard. I’m going to go with Magic Johnson.”

Who’s the best dressed player in basketball?

Lieberman: “Walt Frazier.”

One rule in today’s game you would delete immediately.

Lieberman: “I would not have a five-minute overtime. I would have a three-minute overtime, almost like penalty kicks.”

If you could get restaurant advice from any player in the game, who would it be?

Lieberman: “Breanna Stewart. She lives in New York. The food in New York is fantastic.”

Who’s the funniest player in basketball?

Lieberman: “Charles Barkley.”

One word to describe your game.

Lieberman: “Unstoppable.” 

Who’s the biggest natural talent you’ve ever seen? 

Lieberman: “Cheryl Miller. She’s great.”

The hardest worker? 

Lieberman: “Kobe Bryant.” 

What’s one word for the current state of the WNBA?

Lieberman: “Epic.” 

One word for Big 3? 

Lieberman: “Epic. Epic. Epic.”

The basketball legend also spoke about her life as a basketball coach in the Big3 and how it rendered personal relationships with some of the greatest players in basketball. Nancy Lieberman will look for her second title on Saturday in her fifth championship appearance.